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I believe this is what they call agonic behavior
My hero once again proves to embody the better part of valor.
Side note: Know something? Had I a couple extra centuries of life, I’d write a dissertation about 20th Century nature film scoring.
Posted by: Chris Clarke
Note: A database glitch in 2008 ate a bunch of archived comments. Don't be offended if yours isn't here, or confused if the conversation seems disjointed. Thanks!
i’m still fond of the coyote family i saw on my 21st birthday—with the campus quiet during summer, all 5 of them strolled easily through the quad, enjoying that night as much as i did. the rest of the year, we just heard them up in the hills and canyons beyond campus.
that music is pretty dreadful. and, where the heck is a spotted large cat supposed to be meeting up with a coyote?
By: By kathy a on 2008 04 03
that music is pretty dreadful
Whaddaya mean? How else would we know something dramatic was going on?
Anyways, bit of a happier ending here.
By: By Rob G on 2008 04 03
and, where the heck is a spotted large cat supposed to be meeting up with a coyote?
O’Hare. Everyone meets there sooner or later.
Rob, that clip was pretty much the textbook definition of conflicting loyalties.
By: By Chris Clarke on 2008 04 03
ah, the dulcet tones of Marlin Perkins…makes me nostalgiac for my boob-tube youth, and also makes me want to buy some insurance.
Kathy, coyote/Coyotes and jaguars have overlapping ranges throughout Mexico and Central America, and until very recently the southwestern USA too.
Maps here and here.
By: By Svem DiMilo on 2008 04 04
pedantic p.s. I believe they actually call it “agonistic” behavior, unless they are referring to the fact that neither carnivore forms an angle.
By: By Svem DiMilo on 2008 04 04
What, a clip with Marlin and no reference to the “safety of the Land Rover”? I’m sure I saw that clip in 1971 or thereabouts (thenabouts?).
By: By Charles on 2008 04 04
Svem, I take as my authority Chance and Jolly (1970), who posited that social behavior can be posed as either agonic (characterized by aggression and threat) or hedonic (characterized by non-aggressive attention-seeking and play). The video above is clearly an example, I think, of the former, while this post is an example of the latter.
Kortmulder & Robbers extended this form of behavioral analysis, exploring the degree to which animals might switch between the two modes. I find their work compelling. It seems clear to me that canids are able to commute from agonic to hedonic modes with some facility, and felids as well, though perhaps to a lesser degree given the relative intensity of their prey drive.
This knowledge, clearly, was reflected in Robbers’ earlier work with his colleague Hammerstein:
Oh, the jaguar and the cay-oat should be friends,
Oh, the jaguar and the cay-oat should be friends.
One has a deadly bite,
The other howls all night,
But that’s no reason why they cain’t be friends.Predatory folks should stick together,
Predatory folks should be allies.
Cay-oats take down the javelinas,
Jaguars pilfer the song-dog’s prize!All:
Predatory folks should stick together,
Predatory folks should be allies.
Cay-oats take down the javelinas,
Jaguars pilfer the song-dog’s prize!Jaguar:
I’d like to say a word fer the jaguar,Marlon Perkins:
Well, say it!Jaguar:
She lives in the woods and has a lot of clawsJim the Assistant:
That’s right!Javelina:
She prowls at night and slips between the fences,Cay-oat:
And takes the meat right outta my jaws!Jaguar:
Shut up! We jaguars are good at witticism
No matter what the cay-oat says or thinks
You seldom see us rolling in a cow pie…Cay-oat:
It’s gratuitous if you already stink!Oh, the jaguar and the cay-oat should be friends,
Oh, the jaguar and the cay-oat should be friends.
The jaguar kills a cow with ease,
The cay-oat just gives her fleas,
That’s no reason why they cain’t be friendsPredatory folks should stick together,
Predatory folks should be allies.
Cay-oats take down the javelinas,
Jaguars pilfer the song-dog’s prize!
By: By Chris Clarke on 2008 04 04
For those who prefer lyrics by Berlin:
Jaguar
They say that biting your butt is wonderful
It’s wonderful, so they say.
And with a M of O moon, it’s wonderful
It’s wonderful, so they tell me.
I think that Marlin said it—
I know I never read it;
I only know that chewing your tush is grand.
And, the thing that’s known as agon
Is hedonic, when I speak
In every way
So they say
By: By jmartin on 2008 04 04
Jaguar’s chorus:
My hedon is better than agon,
but your agon tastes pretty nice -
so come get your hedon on, Cay-oat
what I got is better than mice
By: By Theriomorph on 2008 04 04
Coyote’s rejoinder:
You hedonist feline food-stealer
I worked really hard for that thing
now you want me to give it up easy
like agons are free of all sting?
By: By Theriomorph on 2008 04 04
Jaguar:
Consequences, schmonsequences.
Coyote:
Easy for you to say.
Bart the Bear:
Hey, yummy carrion. Thanks, you guys. No, no, carry on bickering. I’ll be over here eating.
By: By Theriomorph on 2008 04 04
Ovid:
All you carnivores can piss off.
(loosely translated from sheep latin)
By: By Rob G on 2008 04 04
[In best Laura Petrie quaver]: Oh Rob!
——————————————
I give not a cark
for your addition to the ark,
but here invoke transhumance
to rid us of sheep nuisance.
—————————————-
By: By jmartin on 2008 04 04
ooooh, THAT “they.”
Really? they use the term"agonic”? Never seen that one before…that’s an awful piece of jargon. For one thing, it already means something quite different (see link above), for another, it’s really counterintuitive as compared to pharmacological terminology, where an “agonist” is a drug that does the same thing as an endogenous signalling chemical by binding to the endogenous chemical’s receptor—morphine is an agonist of endorphins, for example.
I agree the ethological concept is interesting and useful though.
But back to your regularly scheduled hedonic poetry and banter, brought to you this week by Mutual of Omaha…
By: By Sven DiMilo on 2008 04 04
...but then, of course, my second objection applies as well to the more common expression “agonistic behavior.” Huh.
Google “agonic behavior”—this thread is #1! The other hits suggest it’s a term out of comparative psychology as opposed to animal behavior…two surprisingly separate and parallel research traditions. Another dissertation for ya…
By: By Sven DiMilo on 2008 04 04
The video above is clearly an example, I think, of the former, while this post is an example of the latter.
Yeah but to be fair they’ve clearly misspelled “hedonistic”, so it’s not too much to surmise that, as they’re already engaging in the massive reductionism that has to be involved in any attempt to attribute that sort of overarching dualism to animal behavior, they’ve misspelled “antagonistic” as well.
The group noun for gorillas is “flange” though.
By: By R. Mildred on 2008 04 05
